Kurt White was tired of the way people talked about mental health. As a trained clinical social worker and therapist with 20 years of experience, he believes the subject has become far more unpleasant and troubling than the polished sound bites and neat conclusions that dominate media coverage. I know what I’m getting.
“A lot of the reporting on mental health is a little bit lacking,” White said. So last year, he started thinking about what a deeper, more honest public conversation about mental health would sound like, and how he could reinvigorate it.
White is vice president of community partnerships and communications. Brattleboro Retreata nonprofit mental health hospital. As his vision of fostering new conversations about mental health took shape, he decided to start a podcast. The therapist launched “ with the help of former journalist Mary Wilson, the hospital’s communications and media relations manager.unravel” In June.
Six months later, the podcast is off to a strong start, with over 1,800 downloads on Spotify and Apple. Over the course of 15 episodes, we’ve touched on a variety of themes related to mental health, from the nuances of gender-affirming care to family separation. Drawing on White’s training as a therapist and Wilson’s training as a journalist, “Unravelling” explores mental health from both a clinical and personal perspective.
“Our sweet spot is often at the intersection of mental health and wellness. [how] People are going through it,” White said.
White and Wilson typically spend at least two episodes on each topic they cover. One is dedicated to talking to experts in the field, and the other focuses on people with lived experience. White said Unravelling’s two-pronged approach helps avoid two major pitfalls. This is to ensure that individual experiences are not inappropriately generalized and to prevent the ‘othering’ of people facing mental health problems.
Last month, “Unraveling” devoted three episodes to addressing eating disorders. In the first two, White and Wilson said: emmeline cline and Anna Schechtmanboth have written memoirs about their struggles with eating disorders. In the third episode, the hosts changed their approach and zoomed out to discuss the cultural narrative of eating disorders and clinical treatment innovations with Mary Ieramo, a psychology postdoctoral fellow at Brattleboro Retreat.
Mr. White’s interview with Mr. Shechtman illustrates the complexities and discomforts he and Mr. Wilson often experience as hosts. Their conversation about the author’s 2024 book, The Mystery of the Sphinx: Continuing the Feminist History of Crossword Puzzlesranging from a history of feminist resistance to the paradox of anorexia.
“I had absolutely no expectations, but it turned out to be one of the most meaningful conversations I’ve ever had about this book,” said Shechtman. seven days. “I felt like Kurt and I were able to talk about all aspects of the book, as well as the web of connections between each idea, without ever forgetting or sacrificing the human element.”
Rather than imposing a neat answer, Shechtman and White embraced contradiction and dissonance. For example, when talking about the relationship between feminism and anorexia, Shechtman admitted that there was no “clear sense of whether an anorexic person is a feminist or an anti-feminist.”
She suggested that anorexic women could be seen as “acting in anti-patriarchal protest because they refuse to allow their bodies to be sexualized.” Alternatively, she continued, such women could become anti-feminist figures through their desire to “dominate and thoroughly defeat all other women.” [thing] That women are so oppressed and judged based on their weight. ”
Ms. Shechtman concluded that although both extremes surfaced regularly, she did not encapsulate either extreme.
“Kurt’s questions felt really genuine. There were times when I wasn’t sure what the answers were,” Shechtman admitted, but White’s comfortable style helped the two “have a mutual understanding.” “We were able to find raw insight into the issues.” The underlying phenomenon I was writing about. ”
Near the end of the interview, White asked Shechtman what she would say to someone who is currently struggling with an eating disorder.
After taking a moment to collect her thoughts, Shechtman replied, “I just want to acknowledge how hard they work on a lot of things that are contradictory to each other.” [and] Promise me that you will recover with peace of mind. ”
Looking back on the interview, Shechtman said, “No one ever asked me.” [that]. It wasn’t the question I was prepared for, and the tremendous compassion that Kurt was imitating brought me to tears. ”
White believes part of the show’s strength lies in the hosts’ ability to bring out each person’s background. “The combination of journalists and therapists is a really great way to accomplish this,” he said.
White said his professional training greatly influenced his interview style and dedication to swaying listeners’ perspectives.
“Most things [therapists] “It’s about helping people look at their lives from different perspectives,” he said. [with the podcast]. If you can make a familiar topic unfamiliar again in a particular way, you might achieve the same effect. ”
Meanwhile, Wilson, who spent 10 years as a television news anchor and won a New York Emmy Award for her work at Albany’s ABC affiliate, uses her journalism background to demystify the podcast’s conversations. Her experience has given her an ear for understanding story flow and shaping each episode as an arc.
“It was a great joy and a great outlet to continue the journalistic process of telling stories, doing interviews, learning something new and passing it on,” Wilson said.
The podcast has a national and international following and is played in 25 countries. “It’s just incredible,” White said. “I get emails from people somewhere in the Midwest saying, ‘I really wanted to hear this episode,’ or something about it touched me.”
He and Wilson have no plans to slow down anytime soon. “We keep a list of ideas for shows, and the list is a mile long,” White said. “Not all of them will be episodes, but as long as we’re still feeling creative and there are interesting questions to address, I think we’ll probably continue to do that. There’s all these worlds that we’re working on. ” We are only just beginning to touch on this topic. ”
